And that really is the best summary I can think of for this debate
Which is also why I am going to do away with my usual rules this time around. I'm still ranking people, but given the total lack of substance from ANYONE, I cant really judge this debate on the usual criteria....so this one is mostly going to be about whose unintelligible yelling did the most damage to other candidates. But for that same reason I dont think it matter who was ranked in what spot based on polls or my own previous performance evaluations. So with that in mind this time here we go
5) Trump
Ok so Trump got his ass handed to him repeatedly in this debate. However he also did a fair amount of damage to himself, which is mostly what I'm going to cover here....theres time to cover the asswhopping he got from Cruz and Rubio when I do their sections.
However we do have to start with Trump laying the groundwork for most of the beating he took right out of the box. Cruz and Rubio would hammer him most of the night for having no polices, no understanding, no explanation and no ability to even explain his own ideas.
Which brings us to the nights opening question:
Mr. Trump, you’ve called for a deportation force to remove the 11 million undocumented immigrants from the United States. You’ve also promised to let what you call, “the good ones”, come back in. Your words, “the good ones”, after they’ve been deported.
Senator Cruz would not allow them to come back in. He says that’s the biggest difference between the two of you. He calls your plan amnesty. Is it?
TRUMP: First of all, he was in charge of amnesty, he was the leader, and you can ask Marco because they’ve been debating this every debate that we’ve had.
As far as coming back in, number one, you wouldn’t even be talking, and you wouldn’t have asked that as the first question if it weren’t for me when my opening when I talked about illegals immigration. It wouldn’t even be a big subject.
See trump is challenged on something and his reply is "I am rubber you are glue anything you say bounces off me and sticks to you"...and assuming everyone else (Rubio in this case) will agree with him. Good luck with that.
Then there was the time he rather weirdly embraced the Romney concept of "Self Deportation", which as you might recall got Romney roundly mocked for months by pretty much everybody.
"Well, first of all, self-deportation is people are going to leave as soon as they see others going out. If you look at Dwight Eisenhower in the 1950s, they started moving people out and the rest of them left.
Self-deportation, as I really define it, and that’s the way I define it, is you’re going to get some to go, and the rest are going to go out.
As far as the people that I’ve hired in various parts of Florida during the absolute prime season, like Palm Beach and other locations, you could not get help. It’s the up season. People didn’t want to have part-time jobs. There were part-time jobs, very seasonal, 90-day jobs, 120-day jobs, and you couldn’t get.
Everybody agrees with me on that. They were part-time jobs. You needed them, or we just might as well close the doors, because you couldn’t get help in those hot, hot sections of Florida."
Now I'd give the context for the first part there, and why trump needs to define self deportation....but there isnt any. He brought it up himself, no one else mentioned the term, and what he was responding too was a comment by Marco Rubio that the border was considered a problem before Trump started talking about it.
So yea, Trump has now randomly embraced the idea that got Romney laughed out of a chance at the white house, self deportation for no real reason.....also he failed the history on the Ike bit too, that wasnt self deportation, that was the government forcing people out, and it didnt really work long term.
And when Rubio pointed out that Trump had just agreed with Romney on an issue after critizing Romney on that same issue in 2012, Trump tried to fire back with this:
As far as coming back in, number one, you wouldn’t even be talking, and you wouldn’t have asked that as the first question if it weren’t for me when my opening when I talked about illegals immigration. It wouldn’t even be a big subject.
See trump is challenged on something and his reply is "I am rubber you are glue anything you say bounces off me and sticks to you"...and assuming everyone else (Rubio in this case) will agree with him. Good luck with that.
Then there was the time he rather weirdly embraced the Romney concept of "Self Deportation", which as you might recall got Romney roundly mocked for months by pretty much everybody.
"Well, first of all, self-deportation is people are going to leave as soon as they see others going out. If you look at Dwight Eisenhower in the 1950s, they started moving people out and the rest of them left.
Self-deportation, as I really define it, and that’s the way I define it, is you’re going to get some to go, and the rest are going to go out.
As far as the people that I’ve hired in various parts of Florida during the absolute prime season, like Palm Beach and other locations, you could not get help. It’s the up season. People didn’t want to have part-time jobs. There were part-time jobs, very seasonal, 90-day jobs, 120-day jobs, and you couldn’t get.
Everybody agrees with me on that. They were part-time jobs. You needed them, or we just might as well close the doors, because you couldn’t get help in those hot, hot sections of Florida."
Now I'd give the context for the first part there, and why trump needs to define self deportation....but there isnt any. He brought it up himself, no one else mentioned the term, and what he was responding too was a comment by Marco Rubio that the border was considered a problem before Trump started talking about it.
So yea, Trump has now randomly embraced the idea that got Romney laughed out of a chance at the white house, self deportation for no real reason.....also he failed the history on the Ike bit too, that wasnt self deportation, that was the government forcing people out, and it didnt really work long term.
And when Rubio pointed out that Trump had just agreed with Romney on an issue after critizing Romney on that same issue in 2012, Trump tried to fire back with this:
"TRUMP: I criticized Mitt Romney for losing the election. He should have won that election. He had a failed president. He ran a terrible campaign. He was a terrible candidate. That’s what I criticize Mitt Romney — I mean, ran…
RUBIO: No, he…
TRUMP: Excuse me. He ran one terrible campaign. That’s an election that should have been won."
See, so when Trump says he disagrees with you, he doesnt...he just thinks your a loser cause your ideas are worse than his ideas which are identical, but better cause its his...
RUBIO: No, he…
TRUMP: Excuse me. He ran one terrible campaign. That’s an election that should have been won."
See, so when Trump says he disagrees with you, he doesnt...he just thinks your a loser cause your ideas are worse than his ideas which are identical, but better cause its his...
Speaking of having his ideas challenged he got challenged once again on his wall that mexico will pay for:
BLITZER: The spokesperson for the current president of Mexico says that will never happen. The last two presidents of Mexico say that will never happen. In fact, the former president of Mexico, Vicente Fox — he said today, and I’m quoting him — he said, “I’m not going to pay for that,” quote, “effing wall.”
(LAUGHTER)
So if you don’t get an actual check from the Mexican government for $8 billion or $10 billion or $12 billion, whatever it will cost, how are you going to make them pay for the wall?"
BLITZER: The spokesperson for the current president of Mexico says that will never happen. The last two presidents of Mexico say that will never happen. In fact, the former president of Mexico, Vicente Fox — he said today, and I’m quoting him — he said, “I’m not going to pay for that,” quote, “effing wall.”
(LAUGHTER)
So if you don’t get an actual check from the Mexican government for $8 billion or $10 billion or $12 billion, whatever it will cost, how are you going to make them pay for the wall?"
This is of course an entirely reasonable question, and a response that anyone with a working brain could have predicted mexico having, because of course they would NEVER pay for a wall as anyone functioning in reality knows. But then we have Donald Trump:
"TRUMP: I will, and the wall just got 10 feet taller, believe me."
"TRUMP: I will, and the wall just got 10 feet taller, believe me."
Basically, Trumps response to being faced with reality boiled down to
actually to be fair, maybe I should give more of his comments
"It just got 10 feet taller. I saw him make that — I saw him make the statement. I saw him use the word that he used. I can only tell you, if I would have used even half of that word, it would have been national scandal.
We’re going to make them pay for that wall. Now, the wall is $10 billion to $12 billion, if I do it. If these guys do it, it’ll end up costing $200 billion."
Wait so Trump can build the wall at spending 1/200th of what the other republicans would have to spend, even if mexico doesnt write him a check? I wonder how that work....
...oh yea....of course. My mistake actually expecting anything remotely resembling logic here.
and yet the Trump continues:
But the wall is $10 billion to $12 billion. You need 1,000 — you need 1,000 miles. The Great Wall of China, built 2,000 years ago — 2,000, is 13,000 miles. We need 1,000, because we have a lot of natural barriers.
By the way, for those who are curious, the US mexico border is 1989 miles....and Im not entirely sure what natural barriers exist on half of that.....also if we only need 1000 miles, arnt we pretty much done? pretty sure we passed a bill back in 2006 to cover at least 700 miles...unless thats an additional 1000 miles?
Also this wasnt the only time Trump got tripped over a wall, as he was later asked another logical follow up to the idea that we need a wall to keep us safe:
Mr. Trump, you have been very vocal about securing the Mexican border, but ISIS has called upon its supporters to conduct attacks on our neighbor to the North, Canada.As a matter of fact, U.S. officials have warned that it is the Canadian border which is the most significant threat. You have said that you will not build a wall in Canada. When it comes to national security, and the threat of terrorism, why does Mexico need a wall, and Canada doesn’t? Isn’t that, like, closing the front door, and leaving the back door open?
Hey if you think a wall keeps us safe from terrorists, thats kinda a great point...plus that is the border the 9/11 guys came over, just saying.....so what was Trumps response:
TRUMP: First of all, you’re talking about a border that’s many, many times longer. You’re talking about a massive border.
Also this wasnt the only time Trump got tripped over a wall, as he was later asked another logical follow up to the idea that we need a wall to keep us safe:
Mr. Trump, you have been very vocal about securing the Mexican border, but ISIS has called upon its supporters to conduct attacks on our neighbor to the North, Canada.As a matter of fact, U.S. officials have warned that it is the Canadian border which is the most significant threat. You have said that you will not build a wall in Canada. When it comes to national security, and the threat of terrorism, why does Mexico need a wall, and Canada doesn’t? Isn’t that, like, closing the front door, and leaving the back door open?
Hey if you think a wall keeps us safe from terrorists, thats kinda a great point...plus that is the border the 9/11 guys came over, just saying.....so what was Trumps response:
TRUMP: First of all, you’re talking about a border that’s many, many times longer. You’re talking about a massive border.
But wait, you literally just added 10ft of height to a 1000 mile border because fuck mexico. and now suddenly a border is too big too big? again the US mexico border is 1989 miles, the US Canadian border (or at least the Continental US Canadian border) is 3,987 miles. But just like you claim on the Mexican border, we do have some natural barriers on the northern border, like the Great Lakes. Just saying we might only need 2000 miles or so of actual fence, thats barely more than the mexican border if we are adding your 1000 to the existing 700....
Another self inflicted wound came when Rubio kept challenging trump on illegally hiring foreign workers (polish in this case), for illegally low wages, not paying them, and then lying about it in court, which eventually lead to this exchange:
RUBIO: You lied about the Polish workers.
TRUMP: Yes, yes, yes. 38 years ago.
You know I had something pithy here, but actually I'm going to let Rubio handle this one
RUBIO: Oh, he lied 38 years ago. All right, I guess there’s a statute of limitation on lies.
RUBIO: Oh, he lied 38 years ago. All right, I guess there’s a statute of limitation on lies.
Speaking of Trump's lying, he got called out by the moderator for a pledge he made last year to release his tax returns and his now refusal to do it:
HEWITT: Mr. Trump, a year ago you told me on my radio show, the audio and the transcript are out there on YouTube, that you would release your tax returns.
TRUMP: True.
HEWITT: Are you going back on your commitment?
TRUMP: No, I’m not. First of all, very few people listen to your radio show. That’s the good news.
Near as I can tell, Trump is saying yes he said it, but since no one listens to that show, no one will know he said it, so therefore no one will know hes flip flopping, even though he just admitted it 5 seconds ago. WTF?
Oh and again, if you need to impune Trumps honesty, hes more than happy to do it himself.....just ask him about Israel:
As president, however, there’s nothing that I would rather do to bring peace to Israel and its neighbors generally. And I think it serves no purpose to say that you have a good guy and a bad guy.
Now, I may not be successful in doing it. It’s probably the toughest negotiation anywhere in the world of any kind. OK? But it doesn’t help if I start saying, “I am very pro-Israel, very pro, more than anybody on this stage.” But it doesn’t do any good to start demeaning the neighbors, because I would love to do something with regard to negotiating peace, finally, for Israel and for their neighbors.
Now to be fair, right up to this point Trump is actually making a lot of sense......but the problem is he's Trump so he keeps talking
And I can’t do that as well — as a negotiator, I cannot do that as well if I’m taking big, big sides. With that being said, I am totally pro-Israel.
HEWITT: Mr. Trump, a year ago you told me on my radio show, the audio and the transcript are out there on YouTube, that you would release your tax returns.
TRUMP: True.
HEWITT: Are you going back on your commitment?
TRUMP: No, I’m not. First of all, very few people listen to your radio show. That’s the good news.
Near as I can tell, Trump is saying yes he said it, but since no one listens to that show, no one will know he said it, so therefore no one will know hes flip flopping, even though he just admitted it 5 seconds ago. WTF?
Oh and again, if you need to impune Trumps honesty, hes more than happy to do it himself.....just ask him about Israel:
As president, however, there’s nothing that I would rather do to bring peace to Israel and its neighbors generally. And I think it serves no purpose to say that you have a good guy and a bad guy.
Now, I may not be successful in doing it. It’s probably the toughest negotiation anywhere in the world of any kind. OK? But it doesn’t help if I start saying, “I am very pro-Israel, very pro, more than anybody on this stage.” But it doesn’t do any good to start demeaning the neighbors, because I would love to do something with regard to negotiating peace, finally, for Israel and for their neighbors.
Now to be fair, right up to this point Trump is actually making a lot of sense......but the problem is he's Trump so he keeps talking
And I can’t do that as well — as a negotiator, I cannot do that as well if I’m taking big, big sides. With that being said, I am totally pro-Israel.
So in otherwords Trump is saying I actually DO understand how to solve that problem and I'm going to tell you how to do it.....except it turns out I cant do it cause when I said I was neutral, I LIED.
Also Trump apparently gets audited every year cause something is really weird with his finances, and if you dont believe me, ask him:
As far as my return, I want to file it, except for many years, I’ve been audited every year. Twelve years, or something like that. Every year they audit me, audit me, audit me.
Nobody gets audited — I have friends that are very wealthy people. They never get audited. I get audited every year. I will absolutely give my return, but I’m being audited now for two or three years, so I can’t do it until the audit is finished, obviously. And I think people would understand that.
Actually I think the only part of that most people will understand is that per you wealthy folks dont get audited all the time just for being wealthy....apparently its something unique to you and your 4 bankruptcies.
by the way, he tried that same defense again later
Look, let me just tell you something. Let me just tell you something. I want to release my tax returns but I can’t release it while I’m under an audit. We’re under a routine audit. I’ve had it for years, I get audited.
And obviously if I’m being audited, I’m not going to release a return. As soon as the audit is done, I love it.
Incidentaly, the IRS says he can release them under an audit....theres nothing stopping him, except whatever he wants to hid.
But by FAR the biggest wound Trump gave himself was when he decided to talk about Planned Parenthood:
As far as Planned Parenthood is concerned, I’m pro-life. I’m totally against abortion, having to do with Planned Parenthood. But millions and millions of women — cervical cancer, breast cancer — are helped by Planned Parenthood.
So you can say whatever you want, but they have millions of women going through Planned Parenthood that are helped greatly. And I wouldn’t fund it.
Translation: Hey most of what Planned Parenthood does is awesome for women, helps tons of them....but I'll defund them anyways cause fuck bitches amirite?
by the way in case you think he misspoke:
I would defund it because of the abortion factor, which they say is 3 percent. I don’t know what percentage it is. They say it’s 3 percent. But I would defund it, because I’m pro-life. But millions of women are helped by Planned Parenthood.
Translation: So to repeat I'm totally defunding Planned Parenthood which you know helps MILLIONS of women.....
by the way in case you think he misspoke:
I would defund it because of the abortion factor, which they say is 3 percent. I don’t know what percentage it is. They say it’s 3 percent. But I would defund it, because I’m pro-life. But millions of women are helped by Planned Parenthood.
Translation: So to repeat I'm totally defunding Planned Parenthood which you know helps MILLIONS of women.....
Finally there was one last unique part to this debate...I think for the first time ever Donald Trump realized he was drowning, as evidenced by this exchange late into the debate:
HEWITT: Mr. Trump. You told me…
TRUMP: Are you going to ask anybody else that question?
Yep thats right, Donald Trump does not give a DAMN what the question is. Hes had enough of this shit. And in his defense, asking him questions like "what do you plan to do and how will it work?" or "so when you said this what did you mean?" are clearly above his limited abilities....
4) Carson & Kasich
So Im issuing my first ever tie here for Ben Carson and John Kasich. Because quite frankly neither one of them did a damn thing as this debate.
I mean I could make fun of Carson for talking about the "Fruit salad" of our lives or begging someone to attack him or John Kasich basically saying their is an alternative to Obamacare, its socialized medicine, or claiming not to believe your lying eyes there never was an actual revolution in Libya it was all an obama conspiracy, but the simple fact of the matter is, for the most part neither of them said anything...and even less that was memorable or important. Now granted they also both avoided looking like morons, so they still rank higher than Trump, despite the fact the debate would have been no different had they both dropped out.
2) Cruz
So honestly Cruz and Rubio didnt really contribute much of their own to this debate. What they did do was kick trumps ass. So their standings here are honestly less about who did more to advance themselves, and more about who dished out the better ass-whopping to Trump.
So with that in minds, some Cruz/Trump highlights
First there was a straight up attack on Trump's allegedly strongest trait, his deal making ability
'You know, I actually think Donald is right [about how great his relationship is with people in Washington]. He is promising if he’s elected he will go and cut deals in Washington. And he’s right. He has supported — he has given hundreds of thousands of dollars to Democrats. Anyone who really cared about illegal immigration wouldn’t be hiring illegal immigrants. Anyone who really cared about illegal immigration wouldn’t be funding Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi; wouldn’t be funding the Gang of Eight. And, you know, he is right. When you stand up to Washington, when you honor the promise you made to the men and women who elected you and say enough with the corruption, enough with the cronyism, let’s actually stand for the working men and women of this country, Washington doesn’t like it.
And Donald, if you want to be liked in Washington, that’s not a good attribute for a president.
and continued to hit him with it thoughtout the debate. For example on the Supreme Court
'CRUZ: So that means on Supreme Court…
HEWITT: … can I…
CRUZ: … he’s going to look to cut a deal, rather than fight for someone who won’t cut a deal on the Constitution, but will defend it faithfully.
He also walked Donald Trump right into a trap on Socialized medicine:
On Obamacare, both Donald and I say we want to end it, but for very different reasons. I want to end it because it goes too far, it’s killed millions of jobs, and it’s hurting people’s health care. Donald wants to end it because he says it doesn’t go nearly far enough. And what was amazing in that exchange that was missing is for decades Donald has been advocating socialized medicine.
What he’s said is government should pay for everyone’s health care, and in fact, a couple of debates ago, he said, if you don’t support socialized health care, you’re heartless. Now, liberal Democrats have been saying that for years. Now let me tell you if you’re a small business owner, Donald Trump’s socialized medicine, putting the government in charge of your health care would kill more jobs than Obamacare, and if you’re elderly, the results of socialized medicine in every country on earth where it’s been implemented has been rationing, has been the government saying, no, you don’t get that hip replacement, you don’t get that knee replacement, the government is in charge of your health care.
[...]
TRUMP: I do not want socialized medicine, just so you understand. He goes around saying oh, he wants it. I do not want socialized medicine. I do agree with him that it’s going to be a disaster, Obamacare, for the economy.
[...]
CRUZ: Donald, true or false, you’ve said the government should pay for everyone’s health care.
TRUMP: That’s false.
CRUZ: You’ve never said that?
TRUMP: No, I said it worked in a couple of countries…
CRUZ: But you’ve never stood on this debate stage and says it works great in Canada and Scotland and we should do it here.
TRUMP: No, I did not. No I did not.
CRUZ: Did you say if you want people to die on the streets, if you don’t support socialized health care, you have no heart.
TRUMP: Correct. I will not let people die on the streets if I’m president.
CRUZ: Have you said you’re a liberal on health care?
TRUMP: Excuse me. Let me talk. If people…
CRUZ: Talk away. Explain your plan, please.
TRUMP: If people — my plan is very simple. I will not — we’re going to have private — we are going to have health care, but I will not allow people to die on the sidewalks and the streets of our country if I’m president. You may let it and you may be fine with it…
CRUZ: So does the government pay for everyone’s health care?
TRUMP: … I’m not fine with it. We are going to take those people…
CRUZ: Yes or no. Just answer the question.
TRUMP: Excuse me. We are going to take those people and those people are going to be serviced by doctors and hospitals. We’re going to make great deals on it, but we’re not going to let them die in the streets.
CRUZ: Who pays for it?
Problem for trump is, there is literally no possible interpretation of his last bit except that the government is going to pay for your healthcare and/or force you to have it......which is an anathema to the GOP base.
Not to mention in the exchanges before you can see trump getting more and more flusted since he actually DOESNT have a plan or an idea here. (granted neither does any other republican but still)
Honestly the only thing that saved Trumps ass was Rubio deciding to interject himself following that last line from Cruz and changing the subject.....at least until Cruz went right back to it after Rubio was done.
CRUZ: It’s a yes or no.
TRUMP: Call it what you want, people are not going to be dying on the sidewalk.
So Im issuing my first ever tie here for Ben Carson and John Kasich. Because quite frankly neither one of them did a damn thing as this debate.
I mean I could make fun of Carson for talking about the "Fruit salad" of our lives or begging someone to attack him or John Kasich basically saying their is an alternative to Obamacare, its socialized medicine, or claiming not to believe your lying eyes there never was an actual revolution in Libya it was all an obama conspiracy, but the simple fact of the matter is, for the most part neither of them said anything...and even less that was memorable or important. Now granted they also both avoided looking like morons, so they still rank higher than Trump, despite the fact the debate would have been no different had they both dropped out.
2) Cruz
So honestly Cruz and Rubio didnt really contribute much of their own to this debate. What they did do was kick trumps ass. So their standings here are honestly less about who did more to advance themselves, and more about who dished out the better ass-whopping to Trump.
So with that in minds, some Cruz/Trump highlights
First there was a straight up attack on Trump's allegedly strongest trait, his deal making ability
'You know, I actually think Donald is right [about how great his relationship is with people in Washington]. He is promising if he’s elected he will go and cut deals in Washington. And he’s right. He has supported — he has given hundreds of thousands of dollars to Democrats. Anyone who really cared about illegal immigration wouldn’t be hiring illegal immigrants. Anyone who really cared about illegal immigration wouldn’t be funding Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi; wouldn’t be funding the Gang of Eight. And, you know, he is right. When you stand up to Washington, when you honor the promise you made to the men and women who elected you and say enough with the corruption, enough with the cronyism, let’s actually stand for the working men and women of this country, Washington doesn’t like it.
And Donald, if you want to be liked in Washington, that’s not a good attribute for a president.
and continued to hit him with it thoughtout the debate. For example on the Supreme Court
'CRUZ: So that means on Supreme Court…
HEWITT: … can I…
CRUZ: … he’s going to look to cut a deal, rather than fight for someone who won’t cut a deal on the Constitution, but will defend it faithfully.
He also walked Donald Trump right into a trap on Socialized medicine:
On Obamacare, both Donald and I say we want to end it, but for very different reasons. I want to end it because it goes too far, it’s killed millions of jobs, and it’s hurting people’s health care. Donald wants to end it because he says it doesn’t go nearly far enough. And what was amazing in that exchange that was missing is for decades Donald has been advocating socialized medicine.
What he’s said is government should pay for everyone’s health care, and in fact, a couple of debates ago, he said, if you don’t support socialized health care, you’re heartless. Now, liberal Democrats have been saying that for years. Now let me tell you if you’re a small business owner, Donald Trump’s socialized medicine, putting the government in charge of your health care would kill more jobs than Obamacare, and if you’re elderly, the results of socialized medicine in every country on earth where it’s been implemented has been rationing, has been the government saying, no, you don’t get that hip replacement, you don’t get that knee replacement, the government is in charge of your health care.
[...]
TRUMP: I do not want socialized medicine, just so you understand. He goes around saying oh, he wants it. I do not want socialized medicine. I do agree with him that it’s going to be a disaster, Obamacare, for the economy.
[...]
CRUZ: Donald, true or false, you’ve said the government should pay for everyone’s health care.
TRUMP: That’s false.
CRUZ: You’ve never said that?
TRUMP: No, I said it worked in a couple of countries…
CRUZ: But you’ve never stood on this debate stage and says it works great in Canada and Scotland and we should do it here.
TRUMP: No, I did not. No I did not.
CRUZ: Did you say if you want people to die on the streets, if you don’t support socialized health care, you have no heart.
TRUMP: Correct. I will not let people die on the streets if I’m president.
CRUZ: Have you said you’re a liberal on health care?
TRUMP: Excuse me. Let me talk. If people…
CRUZ: Talk away. Explain your plan, please.
TRUMP: If people — my plan is very simple. I will not — we’re going to have private — we are going to have health care, but I will not allow people to die on the sidewalks and the streets of our country if I’m president. You may let it and you may be fine with it…
CRUZ: So does the government pay for everyone’s health care?
TRUMP: … I’m not fine with it. We are going to take those people…
CRUZ: Yes or no. Just answer the question.
TRUMP: Excuse me. We are going to take those people and those people are going to be serviced by doctors and hospitals. We’re going to make great deals on it, but we’re not going to let them die in the streets.
CRUZ: Who pays for it?
Problem for trump is, there is literally no possible interpretation of his last bit except that the government is going to pay for your healthcare and/or force you to have it......which is an anathema to the GOP base.
Not to mention in the exchanges before you can see trump getting more and more flusted since he actually DOESNT have a plan or an idea here. (granted neither does any other republican but still)
Honestly the only thing that saved Trumps ass was Rubio deciding to interject himself following that last line from Cruz and changing the subject.....at least until Cruz went right back to it after Rubio was done.
CRUZ: It’s a yes or no.
TRUMP: Call it what you want, people are not going to be dying on the sidewalk.
And thats the problem for Trump, no matter what you call it, thats government run socialized healthcare...otherwise you cant make that promise.
Cruz hit Trump again later, when Trump claimed he couldnt release his tax returns cause hes being audited
CRUZ: So, I’ve released five years of tax returns already. We will have two more years available tomorrow. And I would note that this question really goes — you know, Donald says he’s being audited.Well, I would think that would underscore the need to release those returns. If he has said something that was false and that an audit is going to find was fraudulent, the voters need to know.
Cruz hit Trump again later, when Trump claimed he couldnt release his tax returns cause hes being audited
CRUZ: So, I’ve released five years of tax returns already. We will have two more years available tomorrow. And I would note that this question really goes — you know, Donald says he’s being audited.Well, I would think that would underscore the need to release those returns. If he has said something that was false and that an audit is going to find was fraudulent, the voters need to know.
Thats honestly a hard point to argue. And Trump didnt even try.
Now admittedly the second time Cruz hit him on this (later that night), he at least opened his mouth.....but didnt say much:
You know, it’s interesting — Donald went — went on — on an extended tirade about the polls, but he didn’t respond to any of the substance. He has yet to say — he can release past year’s tax returns. He can do it tomorrow.
He doesn’t want to do it, because presumably there’s something in there…
TRUMP: Nothing.
CRUZ: … that is bad. If there’s nothing, release them tomorrow.
(CROSSTALK)
CRUZ: They’re already prepared. The only reason he’s not releasing them…
TRUMP: You — you don’t…
CRUZ: … is because he’s afraid that he will get hit.
TRUMP: I’m not afraid (inaudible).
Now admittedly the second time Cruz hit him on this (later that night), he at least opened his mouth.....but didnt say much:
You know, it’s interesting — Donald went — went on — on an extended tirade about the polls, but he didn’t respond to any of the substance. He has yet to say — he can release past year’s tax returns. He can do it tomorrow.
He doesn’t want to do it, because presumably there’s something in there…
TRUMP: Nothing.
CRUZ: … that is bad. If there’s nothing, release them tomorrow.
(CROSSTALK)
CRUZ: They’re already prepared. The only reason he’s not releasing them…
TRUMP: You — you don’t…
CRUZ: … is because he’s afraid that he will get hit.
TRUMP: I’m not afraid (inaudible).
So hes not afraid and theres nothing in there......great defense. Point to Cruz.
Cruz followed this up by hammering him on the fraud case against Trump University....and again Trump basically couldnt complete a sentence
CRUZ: You know, Marco made reference earlier to the litigation against Trump University. It’s a fraud case. His lawyers have scheduled the trial for July.
I want you to think about, if this man is the nominee, having the Republican nominee on the stand in court, being cross-examined about whether he committed fraud. You don’t think the mainstream media will go crazy on that?
To which Trump said:
Cruz followed this up by hammering him on the fraud case against Trump University....and again Trump basically couldnt complete a sentence
CRUZ: You know, Marco made reference earlier to the litigation against Trump University. It’s a fraud case. His lawyers have scheduled the trial for July.
I want you to think about, if this man is the nominee, having the Republican nominee on the stand in court, being cross-examined about whether he committed fraud. You don’t think the mainstream media will go crazy on that?
To which Trump said:
Let me just tell you — let me just tell you, the Trump University case is a civil case. Not a — it’s a civil case. It’s a case where people want to try and get — it’s a case that is nonsense.
It’s something I could have settled many times. I could settle it right now for very little money, but I don’t want to do it out of principle. The people that took the course all signed — most — many — many signed report cards saying it was fantastic, it was wonderful, it was beautiful.
As — and believe me, I’ll win that case. That’s an easy case. Civil case. Number two, as far as the taxes are concerned, I’m being audited. It’s a very routine audit, and it’s very unfair, because I’ve been audited for, I think, over 12 years.
Every year, because of the size of my company, which is very, very large, I’m being audited — which is a very large company.
Translation: I'm beating you in the polls.....Random Word Jibberish, throw out emergency adjectives...and did I mention I'm being audited?
Weird by the way how just a bit ago it was hed been audited for a couple of years....and now suddenly he's been audited for over a decade..... and of course trying to prove to people your not committing fraud is the best time to remind them that your finances are weird and keep attracting scrutiny....
Ted Cruz by the way caught that and latched on like a shark who smelled blood:
TRUMP: I’m being audited 12 years in a row, at least.
Now, until that audit’s done, and I don’t think anybody would blame me, I’m not giving it…
(CROSSTALK)
CRUZ: … the years you’re not being audited? Will you release those years?
BLITZER: Gentlemen, gentlemen, thank you.
TRUMP: (inaudible) audited for those years.
CRUZ: Which years? Which years are you being audited?
Weird by the way how just a bit ago it was hed been audited for a couple of years....and now suddenly he's been audited for over a decade..... and of course trying to prove to people your not committing fraud is the best time to remind them that your finances are weird and keep attracting scrutiny....
Ted Cruz by the way caught that and latched on like a shark who smelled blood:
TRUMP: I’m being audited 12 years in a row, at least.
Now, until that audit’s done, and I don’t think anybody would blame me, I’m not giving it…
(CROSSTALK)
CRUZ: … the years you’re not being audited? Will you release those years?
BLITZER: Gentlemen, gentlemen, thank you.
TRUMP: (inaudible) audited for those years.
CRUZ: Which years? Which years are you being audited?
Again Trump was saved, this time by the intervention of Wolf Blitzer....
And when Cruz hit him on not really supporting Israel.....again had no real defense:
TRUMP: Well, look, my response is very simple. There is nobody on this stage that has done more for Israel than I have. Nobody. You might say, you might talk, you’re politicians, all talk, no action.
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: I’ve been watching it all my life. You are all talk and no action.
CRUZ: Then name one specific thing you’ve done.
TRUMP: What I’ve seen up here — I mean, first of all, this guy is a choke artist, and this guy is a liar. You have a combination…
RUBIO: This guy always goes for…
TRUMP: You have a combination of factors. He can’t do it…
RUBIO: This is so typical.
TRUMP: … for the obvious reason, and he can’t do it because he doesn’t know how to tell the truth. Other than that, I rest my case.
Trump's defense is basically Ted Cruz is a poopy head.....and thats really all he's ever got.
That said, Trump did win one exchange with Cruz, when Cruz accused him of buying off exclusively liberal politicians (to prove Trumps secretly a liberal) and Trump pointed out one of the politicians he donated to was Ted Cruz...and except for offering him the check back, Cruz had nothing. And since Cruz lost an exchange to Trump and Rubio didnt, thats why Cruz came in second.
And when Cruz hit him on not really supporting Israel.....again had no real defense:
TRUMP: Well, look, my response is very simple. There is nobody on this stage that has done more for Israel than I have. Nobody. You might say, you might talk, you’re politicians, all talk, no action.
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: I’ve been watching it all my life. You are all talk and no action.
CRUZ: Then name one specific thing you’ve done.
TRUMP: What I’ve seen up here — I mean, first of all, this guy is a choke artist, and this guy is a liar. You have a combination…
RUBIO: This guy always goes for…
TRUMP: You have a combination of factors. He can’t do it…
RUBIO: This is so typical.
TRUMP: … for the obvious reason, and he can’t do it because he doesn’t know how to tell the truth. Other than that, I rest my case.
Trump's defense is basically Ted Cruz is a poopy head.....and thats really all he's ever got.
That said, Trump did win one exchange with Cruz, when Cruz accused him of buying off exclusively liberal politicians (to prove Trumps secretly a liberal) and Trump pointed out one of the politicians he donated to was Ted Cruz...and except for offering him the check back, Cruz had nothing. And since Cruz lost an exchange to Trump and Rubio didnt, thats why Cruz came in second.
1) Rubio
Now I alreadly covered Rubio getting Trump to admit he lied about the polish workers when I did Trump's section but I did save the end of it for here.....cause it shows how much Rubio got under Trumps skin:
RUBIO: He hired workers from Poland. And he had to pay a million dollars or so in a judgment from…
TRUMP: That’s wrong. That’s wrong. Totally wrong.
RUBIO: That’s a fact. People can look it up. I’m sure people are Googling it right now. Look it up. “Trump Polish workers,” you’ll see a million dollars for hiring illegal workers on one of his projects. He did it.
(APPLAUSE)
RUBIO: That happened.
TRUMP: I’ve hired tens of thousands of people over my lifetime. Tens of thousands…
RUBIO: Many from other countries instead of hiring Americans.
TRUMP: Be quiet. Just be quiet.
Let me talk. I’ve hired tens of thousands of people. He brings up something from 30 years ago, it worked out very well. Everybody was happy.
RUBIO: You paid a million dollars.
TRUMP: And by the way, the laws were totally different. That was a whole different world.
RUBIO: He hired workers from Poland. And he had to pay a million dollars or so in a judgment from…
TRUMP: That’s wrong. That’s wrong. Totally wrong.
RUBIO: That’s a fact. People can look it up. I’m sure people are Googling it right now. Look it up. “Trump Polish workers,” you’ll see a million dollars for hiring illegal workers on one of his projects. He did it.
(APPLAUSE)
RUBIO: That happened.
TRUMP: I’ve hired tens of thousands of people over my lifetime. Tens of thousands…
RUBIO: Many from other countries instead of hiring Americans.
TRUMP: Be quiet. Just be quiet.
Let me talk. I’ve hired tens of thousands of people. He brings up something from 30 years ago, it worked out very well. Everybody was happy.
RUBIO: You paid a million dollars.
TRUMP: And by the way, the laws were totally different. That was a whole different world.
There you have it folks, Donald Trumps best defenses "it was a long time ago" and "shut the fuck up".....
Rubio also hammered him near the end of the debate when Trump tried to mention Israel..
TRUMP: I’m a negotiator. I’ve done very well over the years through negotiation. It’s very important that we do that. In all fairness, Marco is not a negotiator. I watched him melt down and I’ll tell you, it was one of the saddest things I’ve ever seen. He’s not going down — excuse me…
RUBIO: He thinks a Palestinian is a real estate deal.
TRUMP: … wait a minute, and these people may even be tougher than Chris Christie. OK?
RUBIO: The Palestinians are not a real estate deal, Donald.
TRUMP: OK, no, no, no — a deal is a deal. Let me tell you that. I learned a long time ago.
RUBIO: A deal is not a deal when you’re dealing with terrorists. Have you ever negotiated with terrorists?
TRUMP: You are not a negotiator. You are not a negotiator.
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: And, with your thinking, you will never bring peace. You will never bring peace…
RUBIO: … Donald, might be able to (inaudible) Palestinians and Arabs, but it’s not a real estate deal…
TRUMP: … Excuse me, I want to be able to bring peace…
BLITZER: … Senator.
TRUMP: He will never be able to do it. I think I may be able to do it, although I will say this. Probably the toughest deal of any kind is that particular deal.
TRUMP: I’m a negotiator. I’ve done very well over the years through negotiation. It’s very important that we do that. In all fairness, Marco is not a negotiator. I watched him melt down and I’ll tell you, it was one of the saddest things I’ve ever seen. He’s not going down — excuse me…
RUBIO: He thinks a Palestinian is a real estate deal.
TRUMP: … wait a minute, and these people may even be tougher than Chris Christie. OK?
RUBIO: The Palestinians are not a real estate deal, Donald.
TRUMP: OK, no, no, no — a deal is a deal. Let me tell you that. I learned a long time ago.
RUBIO: A deal is not a deal when you’re dealing with terrorists. Have you ever negotiated with terrorists?
TRUMP: You are not a negotiator. You are not a negotiator.
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: And, with your thinking, you will never bring peace. You will never bring peace…
RUBIO: … Donald, might be able to (inaudible) Palestinians and Arabs, but it’s not a real estate deal…
TRUMP: … Excuse me, I want to be able to bring peace…
BLITZER: … Senator.
TRUMP: He will never be able to do it. I think I may be able to do it, although I will say this. Probably the toughest deal of any kind is that particular deal.
But the exchange that really won Rubio the night was after Trump got hammered on his wall. Rubio got a shot in, then spent the next several minutes just landing blow after blow after blow on a totally bewillered Trump.
RUBIO: Yeah, a couple points. If he builds the wall the way he built Trump Towers, he’ll be using illegal immigrant labor to do it. The second…
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: Such a cute sound bite.
RUBIO: But it — no, it’s not a sound bite. It’s a fact. Again, go online and Google it. Donald Trump, Polish workers. You’ll see it.
The second thing, about the trade war — I don’t understand, because your ties and the clothes you make is made in Mexico and in China. So you’re gonna be starting a trade war against your own ties and your own suits.
TRUMP: All right, you know what?
RUBIO: Why don’t you make them in America?
TRUMP: Because they devalue their currency — they devalue their currencies…
RUBIO: Well, then make them in America.
TRUMP: … that makes it — well, you don’t know a thing about business. You lose on everything…
RUBIO: Well, make them in America.
TRUMP: Let me just tell you — they de-value their currency. They de-value their currencies.
RUBIO: Well then, make them in America.
TRUMP: That makes it — well, you don’t know a thing about business. You lose on everything you do.
RUBIO: Well, make them in America.
TRUMP: Let me just tell you, they de-value their currencies. China, Mexico, everybody. Japan with the cars. They de-value their currencies to such an extent that our businesses cannot compete with them, our workers lose their jobs…
RUBIO: And so you make them in China and in Russia.
TRUMP: But you wouldn’t know anything about it because you’re a lousy businessman.
RUBIO: Well, I don’t know anything about bankrupting four companies. You’ve bankrupted..
TRUMP: No, I — and you know why? You know why?
(APPLAUSE)
RUBIO: I don’t know anything about…
TRUMP: You know why?
RUBIO: … starting a university, and that was a fake university.
BLITZER: One at a time.
TRUMP: First of all…
BLITZER: One at a time.
TRUMP: … first of all, that’s called a…
RUBIO: There are people who borrowed $36,000…
BLITZER: Hold on. One at a time, Mr. Trump.
RUBIO: … to go to Trump University, and they’re suing now — $36,000 to go to a university…
TRUMP: And by the way — and by the way…
RUBIO: … that’s a fake school.
TRUMP: … and by the way…
RUBIO: And you know what they got? They got to take a picture with a cardboard cutout of Donald Trump…
TRUMP: … I’ve won most of the lawsuits.
RUBIO: That’s what they got for $36,000.
BLITZER: All right, I want to move on.
TRUMP: And they actually did a very good job, but I’ve won most of the lawsuits.
BLITZER: Mr. Trump, Senator, I want to bring in…
RUBIO: Most of the lawsuits.
BLITZER: … I want to bring in my colleague Maria Celeste.
TRUMP: Excuse me. Hey Wolf, let me ask you. Am I allowed to respond to this?
BLITZER: You’re allowed — you’ve been responding.
TRUMP: OK. Well let — no, I haven’t. I really haven’t.
(LAUGHTER)
RUBIO: He’s talked through the whole thing.
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: Here’s a guy — here’s a guy that buys a house for $179,000, he sells it to a lobbyist who’s probably here for $380,000 and then legislation is passed. You tell me about this guy. This is what we’re going to have as president.
RUBIO: Here’s a guy that inherited $200 million. If he hadn’t inherited $200 million, you know where Donald Trump would be right now?
TRUMP: No, no, no.
RUBIO: Selling watches in (inaudible)
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: (Inaudible) I took…
RUBIO: That’s where he would be.
TRUMP: That is so wrong. We’ll work on that. I took $1 million and I turned into $10 billion.
RUBIO: Oh, OK. One million.
TRUMP: I borrowed $1 million…
RUBIO: Better release your tax returns so we can see how much money he made.
TRUMP: I borrowed $1 million, I turned it into $10 billion…
RUBIO: Oh, he doesn’t make that money.
TRUMP: … more than $10 billion.
RUBIO: Oh, OK. One million.
TRUMP: I borrowed $1 million…
RUBIO: Better release your tax returns so we can see how much money he made.
TRUMP: I borrowed $1 million, I turned it into $10 billion…
RUBIO: Oh, he doesn’t make that money.
TRUMP: … more than $10 billion.
Yep Rubio pivoted from the Wall on to Trumps insincerity on a trade war onto why Trump makes all his goods overseas if thats so bad, into Trump's fraud case, into how good or bad a businessman back into his taxes. And Trump basically stammered his way though the whole thing taking shot after shot after shot from Rubio with no defense at any point.
Special hat tip to Rubio by the way in the bolded part.....he used what he had been mocked for, repeating the exact same line over and over, to rain down blows on Trump.....that actually takes talent.
Special hat tip to Rubio by the way in the bolded part.....he used what he had been mocked for, repeating the exact same line over and over, to rain down blows on Trump.....that actually takes talent.
Incidently though, that wasnt the only time Rubio unleashed a furry of shots on Trump, he did it again later when Trump tried to talk about Obamacare:
RUBIO: … What is your plan, Mr. Trump?
(APPLAUSE)
RUBIO: What is your plan on healthcare?
TRUMP: You don’t know.
BASH: (inaudible)
TRUMP: … The biggest problem…
(CROSSTALK)
RUBIO: … What’s your plan…
TRUMP: … The biggest problem, I’ll have you know…
RUBIO: … What’s your plan… TRUMP: … You know, I watched him meltdown two weeks ago with Chris Christie. I got to tell you, the biggest problem he’s got is he really doesn’t know about the lines. The biggest thing we’ve got, and the reason we’ve got no competition, is because we have lines around the state, and you have essentially….
RUBIO: … We already mentioned that (inaudible) plan, I know what that is, but what else is part of your plan…
TRUMP: … You don’t know much…
RUBIO: … So, you’re only thing is to get rid of the lines around the states. What else is part of your healthcare plan…
TRUMP: … The lines around the states…
RUBIO: … That’s your only plan…
TRUMP: … and, it was almost done — not now…
RUBIO: … Alright, (inaudible)…
TRUMP: … Excuse me. Excuse me.
RUBIO: … His plan. That was the plan…
TRUMP: … You get rid of the lines, it brings in competition. So, instead of having one insurance company taking care of New York, or Texas, you’ll have many. They’ll compete, and it’ll be a beautiful thing.
RUBIO: Alright…
(APPLAUSE)
RUBIO: So, that’s the only part of the plan? Just the lines?
BASH: (inaudible)
TRUMP: The nice part of the plan — you’ll have many different plans. You’ll have competition, you’ll have so many different plans.
RUBIO: Now he’s repeating himself.
TRUMP: No, no, no.
RUBIO: … What is your plan, Mr. Trump?
(APPLAUSE)
RUBIO: What is your plan on healthcare?
TRUMP: You don’t know.
BASH: (inaudible)
TRUMP: … The biggest problem…
(CROSSTALK)
RUBIO: … What’s your plan…
TRUMP: … The biggest problem, I’ll have you know…
RUBIO: … What’s your plan… TRUMP: … You know, I watched him meltdown two weeks ago with Chris Christie. I got to tell you, the biggest problem he’s got is he really doesn’t know about the lines. The biggest thing we’ve got, and the reason we’ve got no competition, is because we have lines around the state, and you have essentially….
RUBIO: … We already mentioned that (inaudible) plan, I know what that is, but what else is part of your plan…
TRUMP: … You don’t know much…
RUBIO: … So, you’re only thing is to get rid of the lines around the states. What else is part of your healthcare plan…
TRUMP: … The lines around the states…
RUBIO: … That’s your only plan…
TRUMP: … and, it was almost done — not now…
RUBIO: … Alright, (inaudible)…
TRUMP: … Excuse me. Excuse me.
RUBIO: … His plan. That was the plan…
TRUMP: … You get rid of the lines, it brings in competition. So, instead of having one insurance company taking care of New York, or Texas, you’ll have many. They’ll compete, and it’ll be a beautiful thing.
RUBIO: Alright…
(APPLAUSE)
RUBIO: So, that’s the only part of the plan? Just the lines?
BASH: (inaudible)
TRUMP: The nice part of the plan — you’ll have many different plans. You’ll have competition, you’ll have so many different plans.
RUBIO: Now he’s repeating himself.
TRUMP: No, no, no.
(LAUGHTER) (APPLAUSE) (CHEERING)
TRUMP: (inaudible)
RUBIO: (inaudible)
(CHEERING)
TRUMP: (inaudible) I watched him repeat himself five times four weeks ago… RUBIO: … I just watched you repeat yourself five times five seconds ago…
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: I watched him meltdown on the stage like that, I’ve never seen it in anybody…
BASH: … Let’s stay focused on the subject…
TRUMP: … I thought he came out of the swimming pool…
RUBIO: … I see him repeat himself every night, he says five things, everyone’s dumb, he’s gonna make America great again…
BASH: … Senator Rubio…
RUBIO: … We’re going to win, win win, he’s winning in the polls…
BASH: … Senator Rubio, please.
RUBIO: … And the lines around the state.
(APPLAUSE)
RUBIO: … Every night.
BASH: Senator Rubio.
(CHEERING)
TRUMP: (inaudible)
RUBIO: (inaudible)
(CHEERING)
TRUMP: (inaudible) I watched him repeat himself five times four weeks ago… RUBIO: … I just watched you repeat yourself five times five seconds ago…
(APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: I watched him meltdown on the stage like that, I’ve never seen it in anybody…
BASH: … Let’s stay focused on the subject…
TRUMP: … I thought he came out of the swimming pool…
RUBIO: … I see him repeat himself every night, he says five things, everyone’s dumb, he’s gonna make America great again…
BASH: … Senator Rubio…
RUBIO: … We’re going to win, win win, he’s winning in the polls…
BASH: … Senator Rubio, please.
RUBIO: … And the lines around the state.
(APPLAUSE)
RUBIO: … Every night.
BASH: Senator Rubio.
(CHEERING)
BASH: Senator Rubio, you will have time to respond if you would just let Mr. Trump respond to what you’ve just posed to him…
RUBIO: … Yeah, he’s going to give us his plan now, right? OK…
BASH: … If you could talk a little bit more about your plan. I know you talked about…
TRUMP: … We’re going to have many different plans because…
BASH: … Can you be a little specific…
TRUMP: … competition…
RUBIO: … He’s done it again.
(CHEERING) (APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: There is going to be competition among all of the states, and the insurance companies. They’re going to have many, many different plans.
BASH: Is there anything else you would like to add to that…
TRUMP: No, there’s nothing to add.
Like I said before in Trumps section....asking him what his plan is really is above his abilities, and it turns out he doesnt have one....and again Rubio scores using the repeat rubio moment and beating Trump over the head with it.
RUBIO: … Yeah, he’s going to give us his plan now, right? OK…
BASH: … If you could talk a little bit more about your plan. I know you talked about…
TRUMP: … We’re going to have many different plans because…
BASH: … Can you be a little specific…
TRUMP: … competition…
RUBIO: … He’s done it again.
(CHEERING) (APPLAUSE)
TRUMP: There is going to be competition among all of the states, and the insurance companies. They’re going to have many, many different plans.
BASH: Is there anything else you would like to add to that…
TRUMP: No, there’s nothing to add.
Like I said before in Trumps section....asking him what his plan is really is above his abilities, and it turns out he doesnt have one....and again Rubio scores using the repeat rubio moment and beating Trump over the head with it.
And those two last, and long exchanges is what it looks like when someone actually shows up ready to take on Trump.....and shows how much trouble the GOP might be in if Trump actually wins and all 3 presidential debates wind up looking like that as they likely would no matter which democrat hed face.
So yea for basically beating Trump into a stammering mess, Marco Rubio wins this debate.
So yea for basically beating Trump into a stammering mess, Marco Rubio wins this debate.
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